Comments on: The Religion of Coffee – Can You Go Too Deep? http://www.roasterproject.com/2010/01/the-religion-of-coffee-can-you-go-too-deep/ The Beans, The Build, The Saga Fri, 20 Jan 2012 21:28:58 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2.1 By: Joe Johnston http://www.roasterproject.com/2010/01/the-religion-of-coffee-can-you-go-too-deep/comment-page-1/#comment-101 Joe Johnston Fri, 05 Feb 2010 00:36:11 +0000 http://www.roasterproject.com/?p=164#comment-101 Jon, thanks for your comments. I firmly believe that going deep in any subject points you to God. Even the creative process directs you to God. The "Book of Romans" in the Bible has a lot to say about how creation is a pointer. When our relationship with God is put right, then there is greater enjoyment of the creation. It is said that "contentment plus godliness is great gain". Hope you enjoy the blog and feel free to comment at any time! Jon, thanks for your comments. I firmly believe that going deep in any subject points you to God. Even the creative process directs you to God. The “Book of Romans” in the Bible has a lot to say about how creation is a pointer. When our relationship with God is put right, then there is greater enjoyment of the creation. It is said that “contentment plus godliness is great gain”.

Hope you enjoy the blog and feel free to comment at any time!

]]> By: Jon http://www.roasterproject.com/2010/01/the-religion-of-coffee-can-you-go-too-deep/comment-page-1/#comment-100 Jon Thu, 04 Feb 2010 22:21:03 +0000 http://www.roasterproject.com/?p=164#comment-100 Joe, The Religion of Coffee – Can You Go Too Deep, gives me pause. In particular "The real problem is that all of them are designed to point you to the Creator, not the created thing." Now that's good stuff! That speaks to my heart in a huge way. I tend to devote long hours trying to master some of the details in my life and my hobbies (at the moment espresso and my big green egg). There are times I would feel pretty silly for investing hours worth of research and reading about espresso and espresso machines, which leads to grinder selections.. which leads to bean selections. Being a perfectionist I quickly realized getting into "real" espresso or ( “really good espresso”) was going to be hard and exceedingly expensive for a working class hero like myself. Then there is all the nuances in between that can make your head spin: for example Heat Exchanger or Double Boiler. Case in point. Each detail of espresso has some hard decisions to make. Espresso has been torture on me. My family and friends think I am indisputably insane for caring this much about coffee. So I pull back probably something like an alcoholic and keep my espresso needs hidden from others. But now, it is more of a beauty thing for me because of your analysis on the Creator not the coffee. What a humble and brilliant perspective to be seeing from. Joe, The Religion of Coffee – Can You Go Too Deep, gives me pause.

In particular “The real problem is that all of them are designed to point you to the Creator, not the created thing.” Now that’s good stuff! That speaks to my heart in a huge way.

I tend to devote long hours trying to master some of the details in my life and my hobbies (at the moment espresso and my big green egg). There are times I would feel pretty silly for investing hours worth of research and reading about espresso and espresso machines, which leads to grinder selections.. which leads to bean selections. Being a perfectionist I quickly realized getting into “real” espresso or ( “really good espresso”) was going to be hard and exceedingly expensive for a working class hero like myself. Then there is all the nuances in between that can make your head spin: for example Heat Exchanger or Double Boiler. Case in point. Each detail of espresso has some hard decisions to make.

Espresso has been torture on me. My family and friends think I am indisputably insane for caring this much about coffee. So I pull back probably something like an alcoholic and keep my espresso needs hidden from others. But now, it is more of a beauty thing for me because of your analysis on the Creator not the coffee.

What a humble and brilliant perspective to be seeing from.

]]> By: Joe Johnston http://www.roasterproject.com/2010/01/the-religion-of-coffee-can-you-go-too-deep/comment-page-1/#comment-99 Joe Johnston Thu, 04 Feb 2010 01:31:13 +0000 http://www.roasterproject.com/?p=164#comment-99 Thanks for your comment. Beware the hot air roaster! The moment I started playing with a popcorn popper to roast coffee (1987) I was hooked on roasting coffee. That lead to starting a chain of coffeehouses and roasting +50 tons/year by 1992. Hobbies can become businesses very easily! I do not regret one moment of it, either. Keep on roasting! Thanks for your comment. Beware the hot air roaster! The moment I started playing with a popcorn popper to roast coffee (1987) I was hooked on roasting coffee. That lead to starting a chain of coffeehouses and roasting +50 tons/year by 1992. Hobbies can become businesses very easily! I do not regret one moment of it, either.

Keep on roasting!

]]> By: @CoffeePedaler http://www.roasterproject.com/2010/01/the-religion-of-coffee-can-you-go-too-deep/comment-page-1/#comment-97 @CoffeePedaler Wed, 03 Feb 2010 23:23:52 +0000 http://www.roasterproject.com/?p=164#comment-97 This is an interesting read. I am just getting into roasting (air pop). I know I won't be roasting the perfect cup, but I have fallen in love with the process. Soil to cup, I love coffee. So I want to roast to get closer to the beverage. I too have take a hobby or interest too seriously before, and it looses the quality that attracted me every time, the fun. So keep it simple, keep it interesting. Maybe I too will build a DIY roaster someday. Anyways, thanks for the blog. This is an interesting read. I am just getting into roasting (air pop). I know I won’t be roasting the perfect cup, but I have fallen in love with the process. Soil to cup, I love coffee. So I want to roast to get closer to the beverage. I too have take a hobby or interest too seriously before, and it looses the quality that attracted me every time, the fun. So keep it simple, keep it interesting. Maybe I too will build a DIY roaster someday.

Anyways, thanks for the blog.

]]> By: Joe Johnston http://www.roasterproject.com/2010/01/the-religion-of-coffee-can-you-go-too-deep/comment-page-1/#comment-44 Joe Johnston Sun, 24 Jan 2010 17:37:48 +0000 http://www.roasterproject.com/?p=164#comment-44 Mark, thanks for your comments regarding the design of speakers. It is a fascinating topic and there is certainly "The Religion of Faithful Audio Reproduction" where the same principles of misplaced devotion apply. I do admire those who take a reasoned approach to the subject. Please feel free to comment further in this blog. Mark, thanks for your comments regarding the design of speakers. It is a fascinating topic and there is certainly “The Religion of Faithful Audio Reproduction” where the same principles of misplaced devotion apply. I do admire those who take a reasoned approach to the subject. Please feel free to comment further in this blog.

]]> By: Mark http://www.roasterproject.com/2010/01/the-religion-of-coffee-can-you-go-too-deep/comment-page-1/#comment-43 Mark Fri, 22 Jan 2010 21:18:45 +0000 http://www.roasterproject.com/?p=164#comment-43 Regarding audiophiles and going too deep: I'm an audiophile and javaphile, and I've witnessed otherwise smart people sink into techno-superstition when it comes to achieving the absolute sound. Though they enjoy techno-speak and gadgetry, audiophiles tend to reject science when it comes to their hobby. Most of them hold views which do not stand up to rigorous, scientifically controlled double-blind testing, yet they hold those views with irrational fervor. I think you'd find any of the following articles interesting from an audio standpoint as well as inspirational to your coffee quest. The gist of all of them is the scientific approach to measurement and evaluation. So instead of doing what a lot of speaker builders do (stuff drivers into a box and design the crossover on a computer and call it good) Harman combines world-class objective and subjective evaluation of loudspeakers into one process. I think there are a lot of parallels to the production and evaluation of roasted coffee. I don't work with or for them, but would recommend Revel speakers if you have not heard them. http://www.harman.com/EN-US/OurCompany/Technologyleadership/Pages/WhitePapers.aspx?CategoryID=White papers Here's a blog by Dr. Sean Olive, who runs the group which subjectively evaluates Harman's loudspeakers. They use trained listeners in double blind tests to do efficient and effective subjective evaluation of loudspeakers. I've got to wonder if there's some inspiration there for someone who wants to develop a technical product designed to produce an affective, aesthetic response. http://seanolive.blogspot.com/2008_12_01_archive.html More: http://svconline.com/mag/avinstall_listening_evaluation/#sidebar http://www.tmworld.com/article/323681-Sound_science.php Regarding audiophiles and going too deep: I’m an audiophile and javaphile, and I’ve witnessed otherwise smart people sink into techno-superstition when it comes to achieving the absolute sound. Though they enjoy techno-speak and gadgetry, audiophiles tend to reject science when it comes to their hobby. Most of them hold views which do not stand up to rigorous, scientifically controlled double-blind testing, yet they hold those views with irrational fervor.

I think you’d find any of the following articles interesting from an audio standpoint as well as inspirational to your coffee quest. The gist of all of them is the scientific approach to measurement and evaluation. So instead of doing what a lot of speaker builders do (stuff drivers into a box and design the crossover on a computer and call it good) Harman combines world-class objective and subjective evaluation of loudspeakers into one process. I think there are a lot of parallels to the production and evaluation of roasted coffee.

I don’t work with or for them, but would recommend Revel speakers if you have not heard them.

http://www.harman.com/EN-US/OurCompany/Technologyleadership/Pages/WhitePapers.aspx?CategoryID=White papers

Here’s a blog by Dr. Sean Olive, who runs the group which subjectively evaluates Harman’s loudspeakers. They use trained listeners in double blind tests to do efficient and effective subjective evaluation of loudspeakers. I’ve got to wonder if there’s some inspiration there for someone who wants to develop a technical product designed to produce an affective, aesthetic response.

http://seanolive.blogspot.com/2008_12_01_archive.html

More:
http://svconline.com/mag/avinstall_listening_evaluation/#sidebar
http://www.tmworld.com/article/323681-Sound_science.php

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